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 Questions for Bob Greenberger (Page 7)
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| Author | Topic: Questions for Bob Greenberger |
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James Friel Member |
posted November 11, 2002 05:31 PM
  
I'd also like to see a few select 1970s archives slowly introduced. Most 1970s stuff is as common as dirt, though, and the idea of doing runs of the mainline superhero titles, for the most part, makes my eyes glaze over. But Jonah Hex, the Kirby stuff, Swamp Thing, the mystery titles from the period when Wrightson and Kaluta and Adams et al. were contributing to them--sure! IP: Logged |
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Medieval Guy New Member |
posted November 11, 2002 06:03 PM
Do creators get paid for reprints of GA and SA material, which was done as Work for Hire? IP: Logged |
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DaBubba Member |
posted November 11, 2002 06:40 PM
Just a few cents tossed in : I think the slimmer, cheaper volumes are a good idea, but would prefer DC 1--limit this to series that warrant them and 2--release both volumes close together. I think a Kirby/Challengers Done-in-Two makes sense. I would not want to see slimmer Batman volumes, for example. If the page-count works out, a Sekowsky/Wonder Woman might make a good done-in-two-slim-volumes release. I'd be all over that! I'm thrilled at the prospect of more Golden Age Batman. I hope DK #4 is on its way next year. Here's a vote of confidence for Sci-Fi Batman, by the way. I'm passing on DD for now, since I have the issues, but I really want 50's Batman! I will probably skip the Adams Batman collections. I have most of the issues and I prefer the archive format with consecutive issues regardless of creator. Also, what does this mean for the regular archive runs? I really want the Batman and Brave&Bold archives to print all stories consecutively, but since we're getting an Adams series, I fear DC might choose to not archive the other stuff at all. Re : Bronze Age. I think there are a handful of series that deserve the archive treatment. These include Fourth World, Jonah Hex, Kamandi, The Demon, Swamp Thing, and the mystery titles. JLA and Legion should continue as long as sales warrant them. I can't think of a whole lot of stuff post-1976 that needs to be between hard covers. Freedom Fighters? Secret Society? Richard Dragon? DC Comics Presents? The mind reels... IP: Logged |
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Pig Iron Member |
posted November 11, 2002 07:18 PM
I think Bob was talking about Batman when he said there was another GA volume due. My Brother will be ecstatic to hear about the Challengers volumes. He , like others I'm sure, really only likes DC's less traditional superhero stuff like Sgt Rock, etc...Challengers being his favorite. And being that he is older w/child only buys TPBs and HCs... There are a few worthy late SA/early BA runs of material. Most kirby stuff, Inferior Five, Angel & The Ape, Batman for sure, Brave & The Bold, Swampy, P Stranger, and genre work spring to mind. DC did alot of licensed work in the 70s and some of it is very high quality and we aren't likely to see it. Can anyone say Shadow and Tarzan? I am really looking forward to all the announced hardcover coming from DC this year. Neal Adams' Batman and Challengers looking the best... IP: Logged |
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vze2 Member |
posted November 11, 2002 08:29 PM
Since I'm the guy that keeps knocking the 70's and 80's, I want to make it clear that I am not against reprints from this era. I just don't think that MOST of these reprints should be Archives in the near future. James and DaBubba cover the major exceptions. I'd buy Jonah Hex or the Orlando-edited mystery titles in a second. I'll probably continue to buy Legion and JLA at least for a little while. I also want to make it clear what I mean by Archive. An Archive is a hardcover in the standard trade dress (with the word "Archives" on the cover) that makes a reasonable attempt to print stories consecutively. The Spirit is a pseudo-Archive. Slipcases, TPBs, and other hardcover collections are different animals, even if the stories are printed consecutively. In my opinion, Archives are, or at least should be, a way to obtain comics that are otherwise unobtainable because of scarcity or affordability. These qualities are obviously related. Most comics from the 70s on are neither scarce nor expensive. Also many of us were old enough to buy these as kids. According to DStepp's survey, our median age is 35. That makes half of us at least 10 years old in 1977. I cannot afford GA comics or the most significant SA comics. While I can afford less significant SA comics, I cannot afford and might not be able to find long runs. The Archives are my only hope. This is not true for later material. I believe that a significant number of people are like me. Am I right? I don't really know. IP: Logged |
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NecessaryImpurity Member |
posted November 11, 2002 09:17 PM
I think the biggest reason some folks have for not wanting '70s material Archived is they view it takes away a slot in the regular schedule that could have been used for another Silver or Gold volume. The simplest way to satisfy that concern is to increase production, so that no Silver or Gold volumes are lost. I'm in favor of Archiving everything possible up to Crisis. Sure, I have almost complete runs of everything from 1970-1990, but I don't like the inconvenience of dealing with boxes and bags. I'd much rather replace my collection with a nice set of HCs, and sell my originals to someone who will eppreciate them more than I. Bring on the '70s! IP: Logged |
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Marty Raap Member |
posted November 11, 2002 09:34 PM
Right on, N.I.. In my earlier comments about '70s Archives, I meant to add that I see a difference between continuing series into the '70s (such as Legion and Justice League) and starting new volumes from the '70s. I strongly support continuing long-running series like Legion and JLA. The goal is to complete everything to Crisis; I sure wouldn't want to stop these when we're getting within view of the goal. Scaling them back a litte seems reasonable, though, and DC has done that. Still, I think we should get a Legion (with Karate Kid, of course!) volume and a JLA volume every other year, at least. As to new series, I support this also, but I'd be more sparing. One new title every couple of years or so is fine. I wouldn't jump ahead with characters like Superman or Batman and start '70s lines for them; I would focus on characters created in the '70s or later such as Jonah Hex, Swamp Thing, etc. While there's room for these titles, they shouldn't crowd out the GA and SA stuff. Hopefully they would actually subsidize some GA stuff. IP: Logged |
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Zongo New Member |
posted November 11, 2002 09:34 PM
I have three quick suggestions to improve the Archive line and increase interest in them. 1. Create a new archive line called the "Imaginary Archives" and chronologically present all of DC's imaginary stories from any series. 2. Change the archives from volumes to years. So one year you could publish Batman '49, and the same year you could publish Batman '64. This way you could publish in any order you wanted to. Currently, if there is a poor quality period then the Archives of that hero may stop, even though there are some great stories coming up just a few volumes away. ------------------ IP: Logged |
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srca1941 Member |
posted November 11, 2002 09:45 PM
I think that #1 would work best as TPBs. The order they came in wouldn't matter, and they're primarly (if not all) Superman stories. They're certainly not something I'd want to pay $50 for. $20 maybe, but then I've never been wild about these... As for #2, I've long wished that DC would have done this when they started, but it's too late to switch now. -Steve ------------------ IP: Logged |
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Joe Pacheco Member |
posted November 11, 2002 10:30 PM
Just had to reply to a few things... 1. Bring on the 70's archives!!! Jonah Hex, Swamp Thing, Mystery Titles, Kamandi, Tarzan, etc... 2. Bring on New Teen Titans 2! 3. The two volume COTU series is a GREAT idea. As a casual Archive consumer, I'm more interested in starting a series with more than one volume. For example, I'm interested in picking up Blackhawk, but I'm not that excited about picking up one book and then having to wait for years for another volume. Also, by marketing both books at the same time, DC gets the promotional push from the buzz of a new number one. Looking forward to sooo many of the projects that were announced. IP: Logged |
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NecessaryImpurity Member |
posted November 11, 2002 10:33 PM
What Steve said. IP: Logged |
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vze2 Member |
posted November 12, 2002 07:23 AM
quote: Starman 2. GA FLash 2. Apparently Spectre 2.
quote: I've done some quick and extremely dirty calculations assuming 22 pages per comic, 10 comics per Archive. Flash 201-350 = 15 volumes So let's give 1 slot to Jimmy/Lois IP: Logged |
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NecessaryImpurity Member |
posted November 12, 2002 02:04 PM
quote:
The point of allowing Archives to extend up to Crisis is that almost all of the characters in the DCU undergo major revision within a few years of Crisis. They become something else. It is a fairly easy to discern a cut-off, character-wise. It makes sense from a literary point of view, even if few of the characters that were revamped got the proper closure the way Superman did in Moore's "Whatever Happened to the Man of Tomorrow?" or Wonder Woman did, or Barry Allen did. But they all changed, nonetheless. To cut-off an Archive series just because the floppies become less-expensive means someone in the Collected Editions Department must keep track of the values of the comics they wish to Archive. "Hey Dale! I just got the new Price Guide! Flash #135-#140 just passed $7.00 in NM! We can go ahead with Volume 14 of the "Flash Archives"!" "Nice eye on the values, Bob! That's why we pay you the big bucks!" "Thanks, Dale!" Yeah, right. If some of you don't want '70s and '80s material, you don't have to buy it. If sales are too low, DC will stop producing those volumes. But if the '70s and '80s books sell, then DC is going to continue with them. IP: Logged |
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NecessaryImpurity Member |
posted November 12, 2002 02:07 PM
D'oh! That's supposed to be Flash #235-240. Idjit. IP: Logged |
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vze2 Member |
posted November 12, 2002 08:26 PM
quote: I'm not suggesting this. Existing lines should continue as long as sales support them. However, I don't think that new lines should be created for readily available material. I also don't think that Archives should jump ahead to readily available material. Somewhere, James has pointed out that the availabilty of issues in general drops after the Golden Age and sometime around the 60's or early 70s (I forget exactly when). Unless we start destroying modern comics on a mass scale, they will never be more scarce than the older material. I'm not an expert on prices, but I think that we are talking about orders of magnitude. If you want a Golden Age comic, there is a very good chance that you will pay around $1000. If you want a Silver Age comic other than the most significant ones, you might pay around $100. If you want a modern comic, you might pay around $10. I'm not saying that prices don't fluctuate, but I am saying that there are three distinct groups and that comics don't jump from one to the other. IP: Logged |
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vze2 Member |
posted November 12, 2002 09:00 PM
quote: I'm not an expert in economics, so someone else can probably explain this better than I can. DC needs to have a certain amount of cash coming in to support the cost of production. The average Archive must sell a certain number of volumes quickly to reach the break even point. DC cannot wait too many years for too many volumes to make a profit. Here's another way of looking at this. I can make a lot of money with my retirement plan, but I have to keep enough money on hand so that I don't starve before I collect. An Archive a week is a major expenditure. Will DC get enough sales to survive? I suspect that the answer is no, but I really don't know. I do know this. Currently, I have pre-ordered every Archive except the Titans which I purchased about a year later. I will not buy an Archive a week. Even if they produce only Archives that I want. Now I can see where a Golden Age fan might jump from 6 a year to 12. Same for the Silver Age. I can see where a war fan might go from 1 or 2 to 12. However, I do not believe that the total number of volumes that people are willing to buy will be enough to support an Archive a week.
quote: Sure. I dream too. I also think that this is the appropriate forum for us to share these dreams. However, I'd like to separate the impossible dreams (I have these too) from the legitimate business advice. Just an example: I think Firestorm would be a good candidate for a trade paperback. Didn't he appear in Extreme Justice (or whatever it was called)? Younger fans who cannot afford Archives (not that anyone ever complains about price) might really want this. I agree it's not a hardcover, but it's better than nothing, right? IP: Logged |
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NecessaryImpurity Member |
posted November 12, 2002 09:37 PM
My "open the floodgates" comment is in response to those fans who seem to be saying "Please DC, don't increase production! I can barely keep up with your current rate of production and anything more means I won't be able to buy everything." To which I say, "Tough ****". If DC can manage an Archive a week, hell, an Archive a day, and make money, I say go for it. The one thing an increased production schedule guarantees is that the stuff we all really, really, really want will be available, in a fairly short order. While you might be buying "Red Bee Archives", I'll be buying "Space Ranger Archives". We can always come back later for the other guy's stuff. It'll still be there. I've been buying Archives for about 2 years. I now have 35 regular Archives, all Spirits, both Tors, and Mad. If DC continues to increase production, soon I won't be able to get caught up. Well that's just too damn bad. DC shouldn't be standing around waiting for me to get caught up. They should be saying, "Hey, here's a guy who has been spending almost $150/month on Archives. What is he going to spend his money on when he gets caught up?" It won't be Archives, if production doesn't pick up. Maybe Marvel will have their act together by then, hmmm? IP: Logged |
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James Friel Member |
posted November 13, 2002 01:38 AM
quote: Sorry, that's not what I said (or at least what I meant to say, if I did). IP: Logged |
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vze2 Member |
posted November 13, 2002 06:20 AM
My mistake. You said what I was trying to say. IP: Logged |
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Osgood Peabody Member |
posted November 15, 2002 08:55 AM
Bob - a couple of questions on the Neal Adams Batman collection: Will you skip the 2 Batman/Deadman team-ups, since they were recently in the Deadman slipcase? Also - since some of Neal's Batman work include segments of multi-part storylines, I take it we'll have some Irv Novick and/or Bob Brown stories strategically placed as well? IP: Logged |
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vze2 Member |
posted November 16, 2002 07:51 AM
I've suggested before that the ultimate goal of the Archives should not be to reach the Crisis. I'd like to restate this in a way that I think might be more palatable to those who disagree. Consider space exploration. I'm not saying that we shouldn't put a person on Jupiter. Or Mars. I am saying that we should put a man on the Moon and then set another goal. Now, consider Prince Valiant (yes, I'm bringing this up again). The original goal was to get all 40 Hal Foster volumes in print at the same time. Although Fantagraphics never reached this goal, it did produce all 40 volumes. I consider this an unqualified success. Now, due to high demand, Fantagraphics is continuing with the Foster/Murphy run. I'm hoping that they will complete this and set a new goal of reprinting the Murphy run. So, for the Archives, I'm suggesting the following. Forget about the 80s with the exception of the Titans. This deserves reprinting, but I don't want to see dueling formats. Had DC asked me before Vol 1 was produced (and I still can't believe they didn't), I would have suggested the complete Wolfman/Perez run in either trade paperbacks or a high-end product like GL/GA and Deadman. Wait 3 to 5 years before introducing the 70s. Start with the usual suspects. If a Silver Age title hits the 70s, keep going as long as sales support it. Now let's consider The Flash. Owen's map has this going up to volume 26. We've seen 3 already, I think. Three posters suggested that volume 9 is the last important volume (my phrase, not theirs). My personal opinion is that 9 should be the goal, but I'd like to see up through 12. After 12, Bates/Novick really take over. Now if the remaining 23 volumes are the goal, then we need to have a volume once every 2 years to get this done in 46 years. If you're really serious about this, you need to give Flash a regular slot for the next 23 years. I can't imagine production increasing to the point where I would want this to happen. However, if the remaining 6 volumes are the goal, then we can live with a volume once every 3 years for the next 18 or once every 2 years for the next 12. I can live with either plan. If the Archives line looks like its in trouble (at which point we'll probably have at least 5 volumes), I would go with one a year until its done. Once it hits 9, we've reached the goal. If we can reach 12, great. Anything after that is just icing on the cake. IP: Logged |
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James Friel Member |
posted November 16, 2002 12:01 PM
That's pretty much a roundabout way of saying that some people need to lower their expectations, isn't it? Not that I necessarily disagree--I think your Flash example is a good illustration of the inexorable power of arithmetic--but for someone whose most desired reprint material is the stuff out at the far end of that particular run, adjusting one's goals does not address what they would perceive the problem to be. They would be led to look about for an alternate route to their goal, which in turn would lead them inevitably back to the possibility of multiple lines for that character (something that I don't advocate for Silver Age Flash--I'm one of those who will probably step off that train with volume 9--but if I considered the final couple years of it to be so far superior to the previous, say, 10 years that it cried out for archiving, I might take that position too.) I guess what I'm saying is that while you're right as far as I'm concerned, we shouldn't expect everyone to agree with that approach. IP: Logged |
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daprof New Member |
posted November 17, 2002 11:47 AM
Bob, Let me echo the thanks of numerous others for taking the time to read this thread. I have two questions. First, there has been talk of DC putting out 18 Archives in 2003. Is this 18 DC Archives plus Spirit, Tor, Mad, Thunder, etc. for a total well in exces of 18? Or does the number include these other lines? Second, how frequently will Thunder Agents Archives be released? Yearly or more than one per year ala Spirit? Thanks. IP: Logged |
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srca1941 Member |
posted November 17, 2002 11:06 PM
I would have to think that the 18 does NOT include the extras. If you take away 3 Spirit volumes, 1 Mad, 1 Thunder Agents, and 1 Tor, that leaves you with 12 archives, which is what we're getting now. Of course Bob could just be messing with our heads and throwing the number 18 out there to get us excited over nothing, but he wouldn't do that. Would you Bob? (said Steve glancing in Bob's direction with big, pouty, puppy-dog eyes and an outstretched, quivering lower lip.) -Steve ------------------ IP: Logged |
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dylanfan Member |
posted November 17, 2002 11:21 PM
quote: Come on, my good man! Get a hold of yourself!!! ------------------ IP: Logged |
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