posted January 25, 2003 01:41 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by CosmicVic:
Hi Bob,

I was wondering, has there been any plans, discussion or thoughts about a Dave Gibbons Green Lantern collection. The collection would cover his run with Len Wein from GL 174-186 (I think) and his 8 page short GL stories from the earlier GL issues (not certain of the issue numbers off-hand).

I figure with Dave's upcoming OGN "The Originals", it would be a great time and selling connection for the GL collection.

Victor

---

I love this idea! There are several eighties GL runs that would make GREAT collections! The Wein-Gibbons run. The Alan Moore GLC stories! And I think a Wolfman-Staton early eighties collection would shock a lot of newer fans with its quality.

------------------
"My name is Mark....Question Mark..."

posted January 25, 2003 02:29 PM               

A have a long-winded question--actually, more of a request or observation, followed by a quick question.

1) Until recently, I have been away from comics for nearly seven years. I'm a huge Bat-fan, so at the time that I last collected I had every Bat and Bat-related (however tangentally) title on my pull list. Then my finances changed and comics were one of the things I sacrificed.

My situation has reversed and I can now afford to budget quite a bit more to comics than I ever expected to when I was much younger. The first thing I considered was trying to pick up as much as I could that I missed during the intervening years. But that meant trying to find back issues of Batman, Detective, Shadow of the Bat, Legends of the Dark Knight, Batman Chronicles, Robin, Catwoman, Azrael, plus the new titles that had sprung up in the meantime. I had no hope to ever successfully keep up to the point where I was ready to try to jump into the current titles.

But, there are trades. I soon discovered that the point that I had dropped out wasn't too far before the Contagion storyline. And it seems that every arc after that was in a collection. Perfect! I have resigned myself to the fact that, as much as I love the feel of going through a stack of "floppies," the most practical way to catch up is through trades.

When someone asked you about the possibility of a Chain Lightning or Dark Flash trade, I had no feeling about this one way or another. However, while I was devouring one of the JLA trades (another source for wonderful Batman moments), I came to the point in the series that intersects with the Dark Flash arc. And those couple of pages caught my interest and now I find myself wanting to read this story, too.

So, I guess my request is this: when considering titles and storylines to collect into trades (and to keep into print), please keep in mind the lapsed reader in addition to the new reader. In my situation, the addition of children and a change of city and jobs were the factors that interrupted my hobby, but I'm sure that many, if not most, fans go through a period where they are out of the loop. And, as a twin consideration, please keep in mind that some of the stories in trades and hardbacks are going to point to other stories and that these should be considered for collection, as well.

2) Now my quick question: Any chances we'll see a collection this year of the Justice League Adventures? How about a collection, ever, of Adventures in the DC Universe? My kids and I are both fans of the Justice Leagure animated show and, while the floppies are out there, my children are at an age in which the increased durability of trades is a factor in purchasing reading material for them.

Thanks for taking the time to attend to this thread on a regular basis; that and the civilized nature of the discussions (even the passionate ones) make this my favorite spot on the DC boards.

posted January 25, 2003 05:34 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Not My Real Name:

2) Now my quick question: Any chances we'll see a collection this year of the Justice League Adventures?

---

I'm not Bob, but a JUSTICE LEAGUE ADVENTURES TPB is due out on March 26th for $9.95. It will collect issues 1, 3, 6, 10, 11, 12, and 13.

Hope this helps!

posted January 25, 2003 07:37 PM            

I'm curious about the "real" reason behind the inclusion of...

1\ ...Flash Comics #104 in (Silver Age) Flash Archives v1, and

2\ ...the Johnny Thunder solo story in one of my favorite volumes, Black Canary Archives v1.

These questions have come up here a few times before, and while I've had my own theories of historical/chronological/supplimental importance (and, of course, page count) we just don't know. So what's the scoop?

posted January 25, 2003 09:31 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by BearPaws:
My turn.

I'm curious about the "real" reason behind the inclusion of...

1\ ...Flash Comics #104 in (Silver Age) Flash Archives v1, and

---

Add my name to wanting that question answered.

posted January 25, 2003 10:18 PM               

quote:

---

Originally posted by Peter Svensson:
Did you see the price? It's a $19.95 Hardcover! It costs as much as the TPB would, but has a better treatment to boot! I wasn't going to buy this, but now I have to!

---

posted January 25, 2003 10:42 PM               

quote:

---

Originally posted by Joe Pacheco:
A)It's for people like me who prefer collected editions, esp hardcovers. The TBP will come out a little later. What's so shameful about publishing a nice book? B)Is it because you'll have to wait for the trade? C) I see the quick publication of the collected edition as a step in the right direction.

---

I split your post into three points to respond to individually joe.

First B) Its most definitely not b/c ill have to wait for the trade. I already have the individual issues.

A) I have no problem with hc's coming before tpb's, for ppl who prefer them, like you. Its an accepted, reasonable business plan. Ive had to endure this for Batman's The Long Halloween, Dark Victory, and Superman For All Seasons, with no gripes. The gripe is done FOR YOUR sake. If you have no problem blowing money, or having your collection split in two, fine, but i think most ppl have some sort of issue about $ and the quality of the production (hence the preference for hc). At $20 for the first 5/12 of hush, im guessing the second hc will also be $20, meaning you (the preferer of hcs) will be spending 33% more on this than similar jeph productions tlh and dv, and this will also be 25% smaller (dv was actually almost 16 monthly issues in size).

Besdies price, youll have the hc split in two. The whole point of hc/tpbs, and the reason ppl love them (like you and i) is they collect those tiny 22 page comics into a book which isnt merely a floppy. Now once this is done, ppl like a reasonable amount collected (ie, 2, 3, 4 issues isnt much, and an example would be the upcoming shade tpb of 5 issues, which ppl preferred to collect 9 instead of being broken in two). Would you prefer if tlh or dv was two separate collections? Something like knigthfall needed to be 2, b/c of sheer size issues, but not this.

I could care less if the complete hc was released the same day as part 12 of hush, the point is the price, and it being split in two (which would be a lot more acceptable ijn tpb, ill get to why later).

Now, on the bat boards theres a 3 page topic decrying this, and some defenders (bat completists who collect everything bat, and get all the hcs for their beutiful bookshelf collection) say they dont mind, theyll just get the COMPLETE hc at the end. Now according to bob, theres no plan for one yet (im sure itll change) Now if it doesnt change, many will be ****ed about hush never being collected into one lovely hc. If it is collected into one lovely hc later, it will either be overpriced compared to its reprint predecessors at $40 (based on what volume one of the first hc reprint) or cheaper than the 2 separate hcs (and i wonder how happy folks like you will be about that) Now forgetting about price once again, if it is in the end collected into one huge hc those who bought the two individual hcs will be ****ed off about getting jipped into two hcs. I know id be annoyed if i had watchmen in 2 separate volumes, only to discover a beutiful single volume edition came later.

posted January 25, 2003 10:59 PM               

quote:

---

Originally posted by Bob Greenberger:
HUSH is two acts, issues #608-612 and issues #613-619. A) They work well separately and together and the reasons espoused by others here cover the same thinking we employed. B)Will there be a combo volume? Mabe, but we'll see how everything sells.
[/B]

---

First Bob, id like to compliment you on your great work. Tpbs helped get me into comics (1992 with the greatest line, which is horrible underappreciated) helped me keep an eye on comics while i left regular readership (97-99) helped me return (2000), and undoubtedly will bring me back after i leave again (20??).

Ive liked everything ive seen from the dc tpb dept for the most part, until this hush thing.

First, let me say, if its not released (point B) as one combo volume, many will be disappointed (including Jim Lee himself). Don't believe me, check out http://dcboards.warnerbros.com/files/Forum3/HTML/009441.html an over 3 page topic on the bat boards against this hc. Most are against the extra pages since theyre collecting the monthly, but some echo my complaint, and jim lee himself chimes in, "sure" thet there will be a single collected edition (and most are thinking single hc, not just tpb) After all the precedent is already there with the single volumes of tlh and dv, and it is the logical release form (unless a story NEEDS separation due to sheer size, such as nml, knightfall, and fugitive, and those were separated in tpb form, which i explained above why it would be more suitable). Even if there is a combo volume, though, i think many others will be disappointed, namely those who got the 2 separate hcs b/c they didnt realize a single volume is coming later. Namely its a lose-lose situation which wouldnt be there if a tpb would be released now. Which leads me to your first point.

I understand fully why a collected edition is being released so early (although it makes your earlier comment about not releasing a collection to soon a bit hypocritical, but maybe your stance is changing), but if the purpose is to get ppl onto hush who havent yet, a much more affordable sc should be released, so as some1 besides hc fanatics would get it. After its all said and then, ppl could get a single volume hc. The hc fanatics themselves would prefer one volume (as indicated by what ive seen and the posts on the bat board), I think the 2 who posted here were unaware that this would be less than hlaf the story (especially the first poster, after all, i dont know of any $20 112 page tpb, and he suggested that this hc is the same price as the trade. Im guessing he mistakenly assumed the whole hush would be collected, as a hush tpb would go for $20, based on past pricing precedents)

posted January 25, 2003 11:14 PM               

quote:

---

Originally posted by gothcityfan:

At $20 for the first 5/12 of hush, im guessing the second hc will also be $20, meaning you (the preferer of hcs) will be spending 33% more on this than similar jeph productions tlh and dv, and this will also be 25% smaller (dv was actually almost 16 monthly issues in size).

I could care less if the complete hc was released the same day as part 12 of hush, the point is the price, and it being split in two (which would be a lot more acceptable ijn tpb, ill get to why later).

---

We'll have to agree to disagree about the price. I think $20 is OK. It's less than I paid for Human Target, Veils, Edgar Allen Poe, etc. If anything, I think TLH and DV were underpriced compared to their size. However Marvel's trade program with huge $30 books is making the DC's $30-$25 96 page books look a bit pricey. Either way, $5 dollars one way or the other doesn't bother me, so I'm not the right person to discuss price with.

posted January 26, 2003 12:10 PM               

quote:

---

Originally posted by ?:
The Alan Moore GLC stories!

---

Come again?!?! Alan Moore wrote GLC? Which issues???

------------------
N. Franco
aka Thanagarian

posted January 26, 2003 12:34 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by FOG:
Add my name to wanting that question answered.

Gary "that seemed odd to me" O.

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Ditto, this really bothered me. Nothing against Jay Garrick, but I bought a Silver Age Flash Archive for the Silver Age Flash.

posted January 26, 2003 01:19 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Thanagarian:
Come again?!?! Alan Moore wrote GLC? Which issues???

---

In the mid-eighties, there was a time when the Green Lantern book always featured a GLC backup story, by a rotating cast of all-star creators. And a number of these were by Alan Moore. Also, I believe some of his GLC stories appeared in some GLC specials.

These were classic tales. He introduced mind-stretching GL's like Mogo, the Green Lantern who was an entire planet, and the C-Sharp Bell, the GL of the world with no concept of vision so he couldn't understand what "Green" was or what a "Lantern" was. And best of all, Moore introduced the evil and precognitive Empire of Tears, who told the prophecy of the Daxamite Green Lantern named Sodam Yat, the most power GL ever. And the EoT tricked Abin Sur into relying on spacecraft instead of just using his ring all the time, which eventually killed him when his ship crashed on earth. They in effect MURDERED Abin Sur by planting a mere idea in his head years before his actual death. Now that's evil!

I don't have my actual issues on-site so I can't check, but I believe most the Moore stories were in the 150's and 160's of the previous GL series.

------------------
"My name is Mark....Question Mark..."

posted January 26, 2003 03:11 PM               

quote:

---

Originally posted by Joe Pacheco:
We'll have to agree to disagree about the price. I think $20 is OK. It's less than I paid for Human Target, Veils, Edgar Allen Poe, etc. If anything, I think TLH and DV were underpriced compared to their size. However Marvel's trade program with huge $30 books is making the DC's $30-$25 96 page books look a bit pricey. Either way, $5 dollars one way or the other doesn't bother me, so I'm not the right person to discuss price with.

Your point about an incomplete book is VERY persuasive. I haven't read any of the comics, and I'm assuming that there is a good end point for the first book. One of the main reasons I've switched to trades is because I want the entire story in one sitting. Without spoiling anything, who incomplete is the first book? I might have to wait until both books are published.

---

First ill address the incompleteness, then the price. You shouldnt fear about the info ill present below. It contains no more spoilers than you would recieve from the covers of the individual issues (as seen in previews)

Here's some info on Hush, to let you get an idea of how itll be collected. Its a 12 issue story arc split into smaller sub-arcs. First is a 3 issue arc dealing with batman, stolen money by killer croc, poison ivy, and catwoman being involved. The next 2 part arc has batman and catwoman going to metropolis to go after poison ivy, and running into supes. This is what the first collection will contain. So far 4/5 parts have been released in stores, and have very little about the big picture (and batman himself doesnt know about any big picture, as there is no holiday like in tlh). The big picture has something to do with a character named hush, whos all bandaged and weve seen very little about. Most of what we saw came in part one, and he seems to be manipulating everythign that will occur during this whole 12 part arc.

The following 2 part arc is having what is being billed as the ultimate batman-joker confrontation. Itll be followed by 2 stand alones issues, and then a 3 part big finale. Apparently the 2nd tpb/hc would collect this. I personally (and front what ive seen, all tpb/hc fans would prefer this) would rather get it all in one edition, which i think will one day occur, although im sure itll annoy those who bought 2 separate editions not realizing itd later be one.

To summarize the structure of hush, its a 12 part arc split into mini arcs of length 3-2-2-1-1-3 parts. The first tpb will have the first 2 arcs, and the 2nd one will have the last 2 along with two standalone issues. (also, this is unrelated, but the odd numbered parts will be action based and the even number parts plot based. So far, imo, the drama parts have been great, while i guess the action parts have been there to move along the story)

posted January 26, 2003 04:56 PM               

quote:

---

Originally posted by gothcityfan:
[B]
First ill address the incompleteness, then the price. B]

---

Thanks for the info on the contents. Based on what you described, I think it will read fine as two books.

For the price, again $5 one way or the other doesn't matter to me. New content or reprinted content doesn't matter, it's new to me. Not sure why you are so up in arms when you had no intention of buying the HC in the first place.

posted January 26, 2003 05:33 PM               

quote:

---

Originally posted by Thanagarian:
Come again?!?! Alan Moore wrote GLC? Which issues???

---

Related to this, when Moore was writing Swamp Thing, he did a atory during the period when Swampy was planet-hopping, in which he tells of a vegetable/plant GL. Everything about it was wonderful. In a few pages, Moore establishes a whole alien plant-culture.

Even the title, "One Ring Too Many" was witty. It refered to the fact that the many of the inhabitants of the planet felt that their GLwas getting too old for the job, and as the age of trees are reckoned, perhaps he had "one ring too many."

posted January 26, 2003 05:50 PM               

quote:

---

Originally posted by Joe Pacheco:

Thanks for the info on the contents. Based on what you described, I think it will read fine as two books.
For the price, again $5 one way or the other doesn't matter to me. New content or reprinted content doesn't matter, it's new to me. Not sure why you are so up in arms when you had no intention of buying the HC in the first place.

---

Oh, i think itll read fine as two books as well. I just know that i, as well as others, would prefer to see it one volume (including artist jim lee, as expressed on the batman boards when discussing this hc)

posted January 26, 2003 06:28 PM            

Years ago, I used to get angry at Kitchen Sink because they released a hardcover and later released a signed hardcover. I think this situation is similar to the problem that some people (not me since I won't be buying any Hush collection) have with Hush.

Let's say you really want Hush in hardcover, but you'd prefer a one-volume collection. If you're thinking logically, you should wait for the one-volume hardcover. But what if it isn't published? Now you have to scramble to get the two-volume set which might be hard to get once you realize that the one-volume collection isn't coming. You could avoid this by buying a product that isn't really what you want and then selling it later, but this is inconvenient if nothing else.

I think that companies have a moral responsibility to their loyal customers to avoid situations like this. This is very similar to my objection to trades appearing immediately after the series being collected.

I'm not against this collection. Based on what I've heard, demand for Hush is huge. There are probably a lot of people who want to get it in hardcover but also want to get it as quickly as possible (and thus avoid buying the individual issues).

In my opinion, all that is needed is a statement of intent from DC to eventually publish a one-volume hardcover, contingent on the perceived demand for one. Of course this is not without risk; demand could be so low that the one-volume hardcover never appears.

Although this is similar to Marvel's quick collection policy, I don't see Bob's position as hypocritical. Whenever demand is huge (not just substantial), collections should be rushed out to meet that demand.

posted January 26, 2003 06:57 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by vze2:
so I slipped the last couple of posts here.

---

so I sKipped

I must be slipping.

posted January 26, 2003 07:44 PM               

Although DC does not have to pay the going rate for writing, art, editing, etc., they do pay reprint and royalty rates to the writer and artist and they have to pay the collected editions staff. There are creative costs associated with reprints. Jeph and Jim are getting paid for the monthly, but I'm sure they're making a few dollars from any collected edition, one way or the other. Either they got it upfront and DC is losing money on the monthly, or they're getting money from the reprints.

posted January 26, 2003 11:31 PM               

quote:

---

Originally posted by Teisto:
I'm not Bob, but a JUSTICE LEAGUE ADVENTURES TPB is due out on March 26th for $9.95. It will collect issues 1, 3, 6, 10, 11, 12, and 13.

Hope this helps!

Teisto

---

Thanks, Teisto.

I guess this changes my question to "Why these particular issues rather than the first seven?" The question about an Adventures in the DC Universe tpb still stands. Maybe the lack of a consistent cast doomed the book but, if we're going to cherry pick Justice League Adventures stories, surely careful selection of stories from Adventures in the DCU featuring the core members of the League could make this a successful trade.