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Author	Topic: Waiting for the Next Volume
NecessaryImpurity Member	posted November 19, 2002 10:40 PM In case anyone is wondering, here are the series that have been waiting more than 24 months for the next volume. Runs thru the February solicitations. 48 months: New Teen Titans (Feb '99) 43 months: GA Flash (Jul '99) 36 months: Superman (Feb '00) 34 months: GA Starman (Apr '00) 30 months: Dark Knight (Aug '00) 29 months: Hawkman (Sep '00) 25 months: Black Canary (Jan '01) 24 months: Justice League (Feb '01) I think we can agree that the New Teen Titans is a special case. Given the numbers in DStepp's survey, this is easily the worst selling Volume 1 that's been out more than 1 year. There is little chance of a second volume anytime soon. IMO, DC really ought to wait for the Old Teen Titans to be finished (hell, started) before continuing with this series. Black Canary is also a special case, since she would most likely be partnered with Green Arrow for any additional pre-Crisis Archive. This is as close to a "done in one" we've yet seen. That leaves some lines that are starting get a wee bit dust-covered. Jay, Clark, Ted, Bruce, and Katar are all waiting for a follow up. I hope we can get 3 of these done this year and the other 2 next year. I don't have a preference which gets done when, as long as they get done. IP: Logged
Rob Staeger Member	posted November 19, 2002 11:48 PM Wow -- since I just got mine a year agao, I had no idea it had been so long since the GA Flash Archives came out. I'd definitely like to see another one (or four, or 10) of these -- Flash is one of my favorite characters, and it's fun reading the stories that inspired Barry Allen. Rob IP: Logged
greene Member	posted November 20, 2002 12:41 AM Proof that it's been an awfully long wait for GA Flash. I've really been pining for some more of Jay Garrick's adventures. Some in these quarters seem a bit turned off by Hibbard's cartoony art on Flash, but I find it oddly endearing. Especially once it gets a little more detailed (shading and whatnot), as I've seen in 1942-43 era stories. Despite some admitted limitations, it seems to complement the breezy nature of the characters and stories. Actually, I was far more disturbed by some of the weak art in a few of the mid-volume All-Star series, than either GA Flash or GA Green Lantern. Perhaps because I anticipate a little dose of rinky-tink in items from 1939-42, but not 1945-46. I wouldn't mind seeing another Starman (oh, I feel faint, Doris) volume, but at this point I'd probably prefer debut volumes for GA Hawkman, Sandman, and Dr. Fate. Not to mention a nice golden-age Simon/Kirby entry, like Boy Commandos or Newsboy Legion. IP: Logged
Carsda Member	posted November 20, 2002 02:10 AM quote: Originally posted by NecessaryImpurity: 24 months: Justice League (Feb '01) i can't believe it's been this long since the last JLA ARCHIVE. 6 & 7 came out so close together. at the time, i thought they were maybe increasing to twice a year, like the Legion did for a brief time due to the popularity of the new JLA book. but over 2 years since the last one??? IP: Logged
Lee Semmens Member	posted November 20, 2002 06:45 AM quote: Originally posted by greene: Proof that it's been an awfully long wait for GA Flash. I've really been pining for some more of Jay Garrick's adventures. Some in these quarters seem a bit turned off by Hibbard's cartoony art on Flash, but I find it oddly endearing IP: Logged
Lee Semmens Member	posted November 20, 2002 06:54 AM quote: Originally posted by greene: Proof that it's been an awfully long wait for GA Flash. I've really been pining for some more of Jay Garrick's adventures. Some in these quarters seem a bit turned off by Hibbard's cartoony art on Flash, but I find it oddly endearing. If some people are turned off by Hibbard's art on GA Flash (I'm not one), they could be positively sickened by Martin Naydel's mid-1940s version of the Flash, if the archives ever get that far. When DC published a couple of redrawn GA Flash stories in the mid-1970s (using the original 1940s text), they were stories originally drawn by Naydel, that were stated to be too far below standard artwise for repinting. One needs only to look at a couple of recent All-Star archives to see a sample of his work. IP: Logged
trout New Member	posted November 20, 2002 07:16 AM Considering Superman is where the archives started, I think it's high time we see another Superman volume. With Superman month in January and all the special projects for the coming year, it would seem appropriate. Brian IP: Logged
Duglis Member	posted November 20, 2002 03:26 PM You have any dates for All Star 9? I know that came out recently, but 6 and 7 were separated by only 6 months -Doug IP: Logged
Mark Katzoff Member	posted November 20, 2002 03:36 PM I'm going to guess July, along with JSA 50 and maybe the beginning of the All-Stars mini-series. IP: Logged
Old Dude Member	posted November 20, 2002 09:04 PM quote: Originally posted by trout: Considering Superman is where the archives started, I think it's high time we see another Superman volume. With Superman month in January and all the special projects for the coming year, it would seem appropriate. Brian I bought the first three Superman archives, but stopped because after getting a fair sampling of the Golden Age Supes, it seemed pointless to buy more. Frankly, they seemed repetitious. I'm one of the people who are really looking forward to the Silver Age Superman archives. These stories are the ones I remember from childhood, and they set the foundations for almost 30 years of Superman continuity. IP: Logged
trout New Member	posted November 21, 2002 02:29 AM I'd actually prefer a SA Superman archive as well. I just hope they put another Superman volume out this year. I think Superman and Batman should both have at least one archive a year, regardless of what age it comes from. Brian IP: Logged
Shazam-0 Member	posted November 21, 2002 04:01 AM I'd really like to see the second volume of the Golden Age Starman's adventures. Also, it surprises me to see no JLA Archive within the past year. The success of Cartoon Network's Justice League series should have put this one on the fast track. IP: Logged
Rob Staeger Member	posted November 21, 2002 09:10 AM quote: Originally posted by Shazam-0: I'd really like to see the second volume of the Golden Age Starman's adventures. Also, it surprises me to see no JLA Archive within the past year. The success of Cartoon Network's Justice League series should have put this one on the fast track. Maybe. But if any new Justice League fans walk into a comic shop looking for a Justice League Archives, I'm sure they'll be able to find one. A new volume would be for long-time fans like us, I'd say. Rob IP: Logged
James Friel Member	posted November 21, 2002 04:05 PM You might be surprised and appalled at how few comic shops, even now, routinely stock back numbers of the archives. Many or even most only carry them as special order items. So in that way, a surge in popularity for the JLA would make it a good time for a new volume; and those who ordered or picked up the new volume might then ask to special order the previous 7 volumes. It would be interesting to see figures on what effect the issuance of a new volume in a series, particlarly a long-running one, has on the sales of previous volumes. I'd bet that it always causes a little spike. IP: Logged
Rob Staeger Member	posted November 21, 2002 05:11 PM quote: Originally posted by James Friel: You might be surprised and appalled at how few comic shops, even now, routinely stock back numbers of the archives. Many or even most only carry them as special order items. Yeah, I do have a good shop -- they have most of 'em in stock at any point. Tons now, in the pre-Chirstmas season. It would be interesting to see figures on what effect the issuance of a new volume in a series, particlarly a long-running one, has on the sales of previous volumes. I'd bet that it always causes a little spike.[/QUOTE] That is an interesting thought -- one I hadn't considered. I'd love to see figures that addressed it. (Heck, I'd like to see figures, period!) Rob IP: Logged
vze2 Member	posted November 21, 2002 05:58 PM I've been wondering about statistics too. From what I understand, the only figures that DC, or any other company, actually collects is the orders through Diamond. Although these are better than nothing, they do not necessarily reflect sales figures. Could anyone elaborate on what figures are actually collected? IP: Logged
James Friel Member	posted November 21, 2002 06:05 PM Oh, I'm sure that all the companies collect very precise statistics on all aspects of their own sales. But they hold them as close secrets. Or at least,they don't publicize them. I'm not sure,in fact, why Diamond is allowed by the publishers to release the advance order numbers. IP: Logged
NecessaryImpurity Member	posted December 05, 2002 07:35 PM quote: Originally posted by NecessaryImpurity: I think we can agree that the New Teen Titans is a special case. Given the numbers in DStepp's survey, this is easily the worst selling Volume 1 that's been out more than 1 year. There is little chance of a second volume anytime soon. IMO, DC really ought to wait for the Old Teen Titans to be finished (hell, started) before continuing with this series. So what do I know? I'd still rather see the Old Teen Titans started and finished before another NTT volume. Looks like Jay is gonna take the lead in the Forgotten Heroes sweepstakes. IP: Logged
James Friel Member	posted December 05, 2002 07:37 PM The Slowest Man Alive? This will never do! IP: Logged
NecessaryImpurity Member	posted January 02, 2003 03:35 PM Updating the list of Forgotten Archives, through the March solicitations. 49 months: New Teen Titans (Feb '99) 44 months: GA Flash (Jul '99) 37 months: Superman (Feb '00) 35 months: GA Starman (Apr '00) 31 months: Dark Knight (Aug '00) 30 months: Hawkman (Sep '00) 26 months: Black Canary (Jan '01) 25 months: Justice League (Feb '01) 24 months: Batman (Mar '01) It looks like there will be another NTT book within the year, another volume of either Batman or Dark Knight, and another volume of Justice League. Also in the works is a volume of Golden Age Superman, but whether that's "Superman Archives", "Superman in Action Archives", or "Superman in World's Finest Archives" is unclear. No matter how it gets sliced, Jay Garrick, Ted Knight, and Katar Hol aren't feeling the love. Not even rumors for these guys. The big mystery is Hawkman, since it had great Diamond preorder numbers (3240, 2nd among all DCU Archives, Jun '00 to present). Throw in the success of the new series, and the mystery deepens. Where is Katar, V2 or Carter, V1? IP: Logged
James Friel Member	posted January 02, 2003 03:49 PM quote: Originally posted by NecessaryImpurity: [BThe big mystery is Hawkman, since it had great Diamond preorder numbers (3240, 2nd among all DCU Archives, Jun '00 to present). Throw in the success of the new series, and the mystery deepens. Where is Katar, V2 or Carter, V1?[/B] That seems inexplicable to me, too. Maybe reorder activity has been low? Even so, the new series should have spurred the production of GA Hawkman v.1 by now.... IP: Logged
GreatBear Member	posted January 02, 2003 03:49 PM As much as I'd like to see a second SA Hawkman volume, its been entirely written out of the current DCU history, so it may be a low priority. I'm very interested in a GA Hawkman collection, but I'm dubious of the art quality after seeing some All-Star reprints. Anyone know who drew him and what it looks like? IP: Logged
BlueTracer Member	posted January 02, 2003 04:15 PM Greatbear -put your fears to rest. there were two main Hawk artists thru the run and both were excellent for the time. one was a very young Joe Kubert (Early Hawkman being one of his first hero strips)and the other i believe was Sheldon Moldoff. Both artists put in some good heavy lined/shaded and detailed drawings. IP: Logged
James Friel Member	posted January 03, 2003 03:55 AM quote: Originally posted by GreatBear: ...I'm very interested in a GA Hawkman collection, but I'm dubious of the art quality after seeing some All-Star reprints. Anyone know who drew him and what it looks like? It's the art more than anything else that makes me want this series to be begun soon and fast-tracked so we get all 5 volumes pretty quickly. I think a case can be made for the Golden Age Hawkman having the most consistently good art of any long-running 1940s DC feature. Between them, Moldoff and Kubert must account for 90% of the stories. And there was one story by Everett Raymond Kintsler. Moldoff, who is an artistic chameleon who has, as far as I know, no style of his own, drew Hawkman in a pastiche of the styles (and outright swipes) of Alex Raymond (Flash Gordon) and Hal Foster (Tarzan/Prince Valiant). It looks much better than that sounds, head and shoulders above most of what passed for illustration in comics of the period. And the storytelling use he put all those Foster and Raymond poses to was perfectly adequate to the purpose. Kubert, on the other hand, was a brilliant original--an explosively creative kid, still in his teens (I think) when he began his association with the character. You can watch his style grow and mature until by the last year or so of the strip, it reaches the first of many peaks in his long and distinguished career. Both his dynamic storytelling and his skill as an illustrator were shaped here more than anywhere else, at least until the DC war books of the '60s, I think. IP: Logged
NecessaryImpurity Member	posted January 21, 2003 07:22 PM [QUOTE]Updating the list of Forgotten Archives, through the April '03 solicitations. These are the Archive lines that have been waiting at least 24 months for a follow-up. 50 months: New Teen Titans (Feb '99) 45 months: GA Flash (Jul '99) 38 months: Superman (Feb '00) 36 months: GA Starman (Apr '00) 32 months: Dark Knight (Aug '00) 31 months: Hawkman (Sep '00) 27 months: Black Canary (Jan '01) 26 months: Justice League (Feb '01) 25 months: Batman (Mar '01) Since the last time this was updated, we had The Great Brave and Bold Debate, which led to some strong indication that Hawkman and/or Atom (who will appear on this list in two months barring a miracle) is on Bob Greenberger's mind. But if the recent Legion volume is any indication, it will be almost a year from now before that Hawkman or Atom volume sees print. Jay Garrick and Ted Knight are still trapped in that other-dimensional nightmare, trying to fight their way back to Earth-Archive. They have a strong sense of deja-vu. IP: Logged

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